Versant 280 Ghosting?

[NorwoodPress]

So I was printing a booklet on Friday and I noticed that the logo from the back page was appearing faintly on the front cover and getting some banding issues. See photo below. Has anyone else had this issue?

I did ring for an engineer today and he said its to do with the image transfer voltage. So we changed all the image transfer colours down to 80% and it has now made it disappear. However that now does affect the overall colours slightly.

The stock I am printing on is SRA3 150gsm silk.

The grey background is made out of the following C57 M46 Y46 K34

 

[kslight]

In my experience this kind of ghosting is caused by fusing issues. Do you have a spare fuser you can swap in?

 

[pippip]

Sorry just to clarify, have you created a custom paper profile and adjusted the Image Transfer Voltage in that to 80%?
I use the numbers rather than %, not that that should matter, but I've never experienced a colour change from doing so. Given your cymk breakup of grey I suppose this could be a possibility as slight difference will effect greatly.

Have you tried setting stock to next weight up, just to see?

Is it just the image on my screen or does the grey look alot different at the top compared to the bottom? If so density uniformity needs to be run.

 

[Ynot_UK]

In my experience this kind of ghosting is caused by fusing issues. Do you have a spare fuser you can swap in?

^^^ This.
Measure the distance between the original and ghosted image/s, to see if equal to the circumference of the fuser roller.

 

[CliffSpielman]

So I was printing a booklet on Friday and I noticed that the logo from the back page was appearing faintly on the front cover and getting some banding issues. See photo below. Has anyone else had this issue?

I did ring for an engineer today and he said its to do with the image transfer voltage. So we changed all the image transfer colours down to 80% and it has now made it disappear. However that now does affect the overall colours slightly.

The stock I am printing on is SRA3 150gsm silk.

The grey background is made out of the following C57 M46 Y46 K34

I had similar issues with my Versant 180 a couple of years ago. The Xerox technicians claimed they'd never seen such a phenomenon. They tried replacing various parts, one certainly being fuser. The original was put back when we saw the issue still occurred. Their informal verdict was that it's a quirk with the Versant 180 but they're investigating.

I associated the issue with printing large solid areas on coated stocks. For example, I print "Pi" posters and always have a large Pi character image in the center of the poster. I started noticing the ghosting of the Pi images when I used a solid filled Pi image. When I changed it to just an outline, I no longer noticed the issue (either it wasn't occurring or just so faint it was no longer visible). It also didn't occur with uncoated stocks, to which I ultimately switched for other reasons as well.

 

[pippip]

I print large solid areas on coated of all weights every week on our v80.

Now i have got ghosting once or twice in my 6yrs of ownership but it was always fixed with either image transfer adj or fuser. So rare I can't remember for sure how it was fixed.

 

[NorwoodPress]

In my experience this kind of ghosting is caused by fusing issues. Do you have a spare fuser you can swap in?

No I don't have a spare fuser, as its a brand new machine which we only got in January.

 

[NorwoodPress]

Sorry just to clarify, have you created a custom paper profile and adjusted the Image Transfer Voltage in that to 80%?
I use the numbers rather than %, not that that should matter, but I've never experienced a colour change from doing so. Given your cymk breakup of grey I suppose this could be a possibility as slight difference will effect greatly.

Have you tried setting stock to next weight up, just to see?

Is it just the image on my screen or does the grey look alot different at the top compared to the bottom? If so density uniformity needs to be run.

Yes I have created a custom profile for that paper stock and job.

No I haven't tried changing the stock weight setting for that. But I did try a 250gsm silk and it did it on that as well.

Yes the top is different compared to the bottom, I presumed it was because of me changing the transfer voltage. I shall give the density uniformity a go.

 

[kslight]

No I don't have a spare fuser, as its a brand new machine which we only got in January.

Then I would push them to put in a new fuser / further troubleshoot if necessary, or replace the machine. It’s really that simple. I assume on this machine you should have a spare fuser on the shelf anyway, i always did with similar Xerox models.

You should have a lemon clause on that contract also, if they elect not to fix. Get your sales rep involved if service won’t step up.

 

[pippip]

Then I would push them to put in a new fuser / further troubleshoot if necessary, or replace the machine. It’s really that simple. I assume on this machine you should have a spare fuser on the shelf anyway, i always did with similar Xerox models.

You should have a lemon clause on that contract also, if they elect not to fix. Get your sales rep involved if service won’t step up.

Versants are built in fusers, not removable units like the DCs before.

But you raise a good point, why didn't the tech come out? Especially if new user still getting used to machine.

 

[kslight]

Versants are built in fusers, not removable units like the DCs before.

But you raise a good point, why didn't the tech come out? Especially if new user still getting used to machine.

That…seems like a General Motors level of design flaw if true.

My opinion - you pay big money for on site service, the tech needs to come out. And if they can’t solve it to your satisfaction/machine spec, then you go further up the chain until it is fixed. Phone support is only acceptable in the event you don’t have a service contract.

 

[pippip]

Maybe the op is remote, in all our years of Xerox I've never had them attempt phone support. And like others i've called them out for what ended up being the stupidest oversight on my part and they've always been understanding. BUT the ops problem here is well worth calling them out, already look at the time wasted, job should have been out the door by now.

To be fair the fusers are pretty bullet proof (as I whisper with ours in earshot), rarely a problem between lifespan, OP may just be unlucky.

 

[TJPrinter]

So I was printing a booklet on Friday and I noticed that the logo from the back page was appearing faintly on the front cover and getting some banding issues. See photo below. Has anyone else had this issue?

I did ring for an engineer today and he said its to do with the image transfer voltage. So we changed all the image transfer colours down to 80% and it has now made it disappear. However that now does affect the overall colours slightly.

The stock I am printing on is SRA3 150gsm silk.

The grey background is made out of the following C57 M46 Y46 K34

I don’t think that you’ll be able to get rid of the light banding in a screen like this but sometimes you can reduce the visual effect by changing the printer screen mode on the Fiery. A little experimentation may be needed to reduce the banding to where you’re happier. Hopefully running the density uniformity helped you with color balance across the sheet.

Versants are built in fusers, not removable units like the DCs before.

The older fusers were all one piece and easy to replace. The new belt fusers can also be user replaced but they aren’t a simple lift and out they go. The good part is that you really don’t need multiple fusers on hand for different width papers and envelopes. You’ll have a metal holder for the fuser and several small tools that are used to pull out the fuser and the fuser roller. The tools are shipped with the Versant in one of the 3 main trays. Pull out the trays and access the end cap on the right side of the trays, inside will be the tools and some other documentation. The fuser cover hinges up and is held closed by just two skews so not really a big deal to change but certainly more time consuming than the older fusers.

 

[Make_It_So]

That…seems like a General Motors level of design flaw if true.

My opinion - you pay big money for on site service, the tech needs to come out. And if they can’t solve it to your satisfaction/machine spec, then you go further up the chain until it is fixed. Phone support is only acceptable in the event you don’t have a service contract.

At my previous employer (RIP) we had a V80 and after 4 years it really started to go crazy. We did exactly what you said here. I felt like the service dept just brushed us off. I got one of our executives involved who got in touch the local Service manager's boss and Xerox went nuts trying to figure out our problem. They ended up doing a "like for like" exchange even-though the machine was ran into the ground. The replacement machine was a dream up until the company closed their doors (they were bought).

Go up the service chain if you feel you are not being taken care of. They take it seriously.

 

[kslight]

At my previous employer (RIP) we had a V80 and after 4 years it really started to go crazy. We did exactly what you said here. I felt like the service dept just brushed us off. I got one of our executives involved who got in touch the local Service manager's boss and Xerox went nuts trying to figure out our problem. They ended up doing a "like for like" exchange even-though the machine was ran into the ground. The replacement machine was a dream up until the company closed their doors (they were bought).

Go up the service chain if you feel you are not being taken care of. They take it seriously.

Yep, I’ve been down that road a few times, at the like for like route and also just the frustration of ongoing issues. Bad machines make it out into the field, or sometimes the techs are not equipped with the right training, tools, or diagnostic abilities to resolve your issue in a reasonable amount of time. That is fine and understandable, some issues are very specific and difficult to narrow down - but what happens after that point sets the mood for the service provider.

So when I say something like “put in a fuser” as a troubleshooting step - that’s like okay if you guys want to try to find out exactly what’s wrong with this specific fuser on your own time be my guest, but while we are waiting you can put another one in and see if that solves the problem, gets us back in business. Nobody wins if I’m not printing my jobs on this machine.

We had a Konica tech DROP our fuser, and for 11 months fought issues. After that technician moved we finally got the right person to just put in a different fuser (not a NEW fuser like it should have been, an old one with different issues, but I digress…).

With a new machine like the OP has, every day that machine was broken I’d be on the horn with my sales rep telling them to pack it up and cancel the contract, or fix it, if service was unwilling to come out for a service call.

 

[tngcas]

I've had this happen once with our Canon printer. Flattening the file in photoshop fixed the problem, not the ideal solution (and won't work for some files that need better resolutions) but something about the layers and how the printer was putting them down was making the ghost appear. Might not solve the problem every time but sometimes it works.