What do you think of the new "Adobe Cloud?"

[Alith7]

Yup. I went there.

This is a topic that we have been kicking around our prepress department for a couple months now. And as we get closer to the official "Launch" of this, I was wondering what the rest of you really think about this.

From an independent designer with one computer stand point, I can see where it would be a benefit. It is cheaper than upgrades every year to stay on top of the technology, and allows you to always be cutting edge. That's great for them. They're the ones who are going to kill me on this, because they are going to stay "up-to-date" and force me to follow.

From a prepress manager's stand point where I have 4 macs in my main department and a total of 10 in my other stores, I'm not even sure how to approach the owner with the upcoming costs of this insanity! We stay on top of the current versions, but be upgrade as necessary. We might upgrade just one to the latest version to handle those "cutting edge" designers and customers that always have to have the latest and greatest, but generally, the majority of them get upgraded as needed when the latest version becomes main stream. Usually almost 2 years, and not uncommon for some of them to skip an upgrade depending on how close they come out and are picked up. And, what's worse, from what I gather Adobe currently has NO intention of offering volume licensing support anymore.

So, what do you think? What size shop are you from, or are you a designer or a software programer? How do you think this will affect your production? Or, do you just want to vent about the stupidity of it all?

 

[CathieHarris]

I really don't have anything to add, as I work at a small printshop whose owner thinks the cloud is bunch of crapola. I've been reading about it and it does look good for small shops, but not for larger companies like yours.

Basically, I just want to hear what others have to say about this. We're still pretty old school using CS3 and it's working ok for us, but there will come the day when we'll have no choice but to raise up to the cloud.

So I'm interesting in the new comments coming into this thread to see how it's working for everyone that's joined, what the pitfalls are, what the benefits are, and how it compares to the "old" way of doing things with CS.

Thanks for posting.
Cathie

 

[kansasquaker]

I'm not sure it is any cheaper to say up-to-date. $50 per month = $600 per year = the $600 upgrade which was released about annually. Of course it a great deal for Adobe because once you go cloud you're essentially forced to buy the equivalent of the annual upgrade. I think that's a load of crap. We have customers who still use CS3. And it's just fine for what they do. Why should they have to pay for new software that they don't need?

And as a side note, the UI is absolutely hideous . . .

 

[CathieHarris]

What's wrong with the UI?

 

[dabob]

I've had if for a couple of weeks and there are some things I would change and some I wish they hadn't but all in all not bad - as to the costs associated with it - if you want to keep the customers that upgrade to it you better figure it as a cost of doing business otherwise . . . your competition will be happy to bite the bullet and upgrade in order to get the customer . . .

 

[Alith7]

I've had if for a couple of weeks and there are some things I would change and some I wish they hadn't but all in all not bad - as to the costs associated with it - if you want to keep the customers that upgrade to it you better figure it as a cost of doing business otherwise . . . your competition will be happy to bite the bullet and upgrade in order to get the customer . . .

oh, we'll upgrade. Always have. I let my customers dictate "When" though. Like Quark. I have one mac with Quark 9. the rest are still quark 7. Not that we use it anymore. but that's a different rant for a different day. CS6 though. Due to the economy, the designers as a general rule didn't seem interested in spending money to upgrade until it had been out for over a year. We had one mac that had it for the 1 or 2 files we'd get every couple weeks, but it wasn't a big deal. We just upgraded the last mac about a month ago actually. But, with this Cloud, once the main stream is there, we're stuck with it.
I'm not saying I'm not going to upgrade to it...eventually. it's just really annoying having Adobe force my hand. Also, once you have it, there is no option for just keeping a slightly outdated home use comp for small projects. Since you never actually "OWN" the software, you have to KEEP paying for it forever to make use of it.

 

[zoran]

There is another thread with lot's of noise on the same topic.
The way I see it is you either upgrade (what Adobe wants) or you change your company's policy to accept only PDF's and CS up to CS6, effectively shooting yourself in a foot as your competitor will tell designer/client, yes dear, we accept any version, just come to us.

Another interim option that will work fine is to do what you always did, buy couple of seats of CC so you can export IDML and open on your CS6 machines. This option is fine for the time being and as long as you can retain your old computers with old systems. Once you go through couple of system upgrades, Adobe CS6 and earlier will stop functioning and/or will not be supported and you will be forced onto Adobe CC, whether you want it or not.
Adobe figured this while ago and that is why they are so ignorant with their reply to the masses "upgrade or die, we don't care" (in my translation).
They could have easily segregated us, print providers into special category and give us what we need for decent price that we were paying so far, they chose not to.
They've got some brains on their payroll who figured it out, how to double the revenue while you are holding entire graphic/creative industry by the ... (you fill in the blanks).

 

[Alith7]

It will be interesting to see the long term effects of this. Will Adobe go the way of Quark when Quark got so arrogant and decided that they didn't need to stay with the industry trends, OR play well with the school systems. They signed their own death warrant that way. I wonder if that is what will happen to Adobe? Should be an interesting couple of years to see how this plays out.

BTW, to you know where that other thread is? I would love to read through it.

 

[CathieHarris]

http://printplanet.com/forums/adobe/31157-creative-cloud-thoughts

Here's the thread. It's very interesting reading, but only a few posts AFTER CC came out. That's why I was glad you started a new one now that it's live and people are working with it.

 

[Alith7]

Not that it really makes it any better, but if you already have CS6, you can get a 1 year subscription for $19.99/month. slightly better, but it's still a dirty business.

https://creative.adobe.com/join/offer/cs6_complete?trackingid=KHOQO

I just figure that since I'm going to have to put it on at least one computer anyways, might as well pay half the price for it...

 

[dabob]

From what I understand - you buy a 1 year contract and if you choose to stop the contract at the end of that year you still have a workable copy on your computer . . . you just stop getting updates what you have you can still run . . . at least thats how I understand it . . .

 

[Alith7]

From what I understand - you buy a 1 year contract and if you choose to stop the contract at the end of that year you still have a workable copy on your computer . . . you just stop getting updates what you have you can still run . . . at least thats how I understand it . . .

I can't find "clearer" wording, but basically, no. that is not how it works. that would be a "perpetual" license, which, as quoted from Adobe's FAQ, is not the case.

From Adobe:

Can I purchase a perpetual license for the new Creative Cloud desktop applications that were announced in May 2013?

No. The new CC versions of the desktop applications are available only through Creative Cloud offerings for individuals, teams, and enterprise. We do not have any current plans to release future CC tools outside Creative Cloud.

However, for organizations such as government agencies and educational institutions that are unable to deploy cloud services, we offer Creative Cloud desktop apps through a Creative Cloud Desktop Applications subscription for government agencies, and via the Adobe Education Enterprise Agreement (EEA) for educational institutions through the channel.

 

[Hopkins Printing]

Hi dabob,

As I understand it from more than one source, if a user allows their subscription to expire, all CC software will eventually seize to function. If someone from Adobe knows otherwise, please correct me here!!

Thanks,
hp

 

[dabob]

This is from leonardr (from adobe) from the previous thread about CC

Maybe the truth has changed . . .



Quote Originally Posted by brent View Post
Once this program gets established and people get on board they will be held hostage to any price increase Adobe chooses to make. There will now be NO option other than to pay Adobe as your software will cease to exist if a company chooses to opt out of the cloud program due to price increases. And once that happens all legacy files will be trash as they probably will not work with CS6 in the future after a few upgrades.
This is a very common misunderstanding about the Creative Cloud and is simply NOT TRUE.

All subscription members will be able to access previous versions (I forget if it's one or two versions back) for archival & compatibility purposes. So, if you do choose to stop your subscription, you will have access to previous versions. And you can restart your subscription at any time - and catch right back up!


I just do not see ANY benefit for a printer. Am I missing something?
Each person, company, industry, etc. will need to determine if it is in their business interest or not. Just as you choose where to spend your money on everything else in your business - be it hardware, internet access, phone lines or beer & pretzels - whether to move to the Creative Cloud is up to you. I can only help you understand what WE see as the benefits to the wider set of our users.

If you choose not to join, it's your choice. We're sorry to see you go and wish you the best.

 

[Alith7]

...snip....
Quote Originally Posted by brent View Post
Once this program gets established and people get on board they will be held hostage to any price increase Adobe chooses to make. There will now be NO option other than to pay Adobe as your software will cease to exist if a company chooses to opt out of the cloud program due to price increases. And once that happens all legacy files will be trash as they probably will not work with CS6 in the future after a few upgrades.
This is a very common misunderstanding about the Creative Cloud and is simply NOT TRUE.

All subscription members will be able to access previous versions (I forget if it's one or two versions back) for archival & compatibility purposes. So, if you do choose to stop your subscription, you will have access to previous versions. And you can restart your subscription at any time - and catch right back up!


...snip

ok...that's not saying the SOFTWARE will work, only the files. I did read that on the last thread. basically, he's saying (and I could be interpreting it wrong) that you can save the files backwards compatible, and still use them with your older versions of the software (if you still have them, or had them in the first place) but that the Cloud Software will cease functioning until you reactive your subscription.

If I have that wrong, please, someone correct me. And while I REALLY appreciate all the great minds on this forum, please link to the relevant hard proof on Adobe's site, not hearsay.

 

[brent]

Yes you "could" save backwards…the only problem is that if the file uses a new feature from CC, it will not translate back to CS6. Very dangerous in my opinion. Our shop is holding off for now. We have not received any CC files yet, and if we do, we will just ask for a print ready pdf, which 95% of our clients do anyway.

We really are in a holding pattern to see how this shakes up. The potential to not have access to our library or Adobe pricing this out of the water down line after everyone has been held captive, just does not sit well with us. There really has to be a middle ground for print providers.

 

[biggreydog]

Yes you "could" save backwards…the only problem is that if the file uses a new feature from CC, it will not translate back to CS6.......

I working a job now that was created in CC. The client saved the files down to CS6, but images shifted inside their windows. We now have CC on one machine.

What I wonder now is how often Adobe will upgrade software in the future. In the past the upgrades were needed to create a revenue stream, but with the 30 day license that is no longer needed.

 

[kansasquaker]

This is from leonardr (from adobe) from the previous thread about CC

Each person, company, industry, etc. will need to determine if it is in their business interest or not. Just as you choose where to spend your money on everything else in your business - be it hardware, internet access, phone lines or beer & pretzels - whether to move to the Creative Cloud is up to you. I can only help you understand what WE see as the benefits to the wider set of our users.

It really irks me that Adobe has the gall to claim CC is a benefit to their customers. Of course it isn't. CC forces the customer into a perpetual upgrade, regardless of the value of the "new features" to the end user. In the past a user could look at the new features and decide if they were worth the upgrade cost. Now, they have no choice. If they quit paying the software quits working. That's not a benefit, it's much closer to extortion.

This is from leonardr (from adobe) from the previous thread about CC

If you choose not to join, it's your choice. We're sorry to see you go and wish you the best.

Where else could a user go? Oh wait, Adobe just realized, they can't go anywhere else now. What a great time to release CC and shackle customers to a recurring payment scheme. If it's really to benefit your customers, why not leave an option for outright purchase as has existed in the past? That would allow everyone to "choose where to spend their money."

The truth is that CC is only possible because Adobe's competition is effectually dead. This is monopoly behavior at its worst. I, for one, think it's repugnant.

 

[Alith7]

...snip...
That's not a benefit, it's much closer to extortion.
...snip...
The truth is that CC is only possible because Adobe's competition is effectually dead. This is monopoly behavior at its worst. I, for one, think it's repugnant.

Here here!!
as I posted earlier, this is a PERFECT time for Quark to step up and move back into the spotlight. Ironically, I did notice they just released Quark 10

 

[dabob]

I'm still trying to get a hold of some friends in places that would know at adobe . . . will keep you posted -

But in my opinion, if they kick the price too much there would be a federal anti trust investigation or a class action lawsuit - which would effectively kill them - there's a saying "Pigs get fat, hogs get slaughtered"