4 staple booket maker? Square back folder?

[Dan2122]

Hi does anyone know of a booklet maker that will fix 4 staples, Sadlestich?

Also does a squareback folder make your booklets stronger? Seeing as the staples are then not on the crease?

Cheers

 

[Ynot_UK]

Most manufacturers higher end booklet makers offer a 4-head option (eg: Plockmatic BM5035S, C.P.Bourg BM-e). But you'll find they're heavy on space as well as on the pocket. On a budget, look at the Kasfold 3000, which also has a smaller footprint.

 

[halmac]

Watkiss is the best, coolest square back folder. But you have to have deep pockets. It is also quite slow. But like those of us who are slow it does the job the best. Just watching the video is awesome. Is has one staplehead that moves across the spine for as many stitches as you want. And it has this super brass clamp for the squarefold.

 

[bcr]

Watkiss is the best, coolest square back folder. But you have to have deep pockets. It is also quite slow. But like those of us who are slow it does the job the best. Just watching the video is awesome. Is has one staplehead that moves across the spine for as many stitches as you want. And it has this super brass clamp for the squarefold.

Any idea what the approximate pricing is like for the powersquare 160?

 

[Ynot_UK]

Any idea what the approximate pricing is like for the powersquare 160?

To give a ballpark, there's a refurbed one with half a million on the clock here for 27k euros

 

[bcr]

To give a ballpark, there's a refurbed one with half a million on the clock here for 27k euros

Thanks!

 

[tdbb]

How big of books are you talking? Are you looking to run inline or offline? If you are not afraid of using some older used equipment that will be a little friendlier on the wallet and what you are trying to run is 22 sheets (88 page book) or less then I believe that C.P.Bourg BDF line can also be configured to work with 4 heads. However I have only needed to use the 2 headed configuration so I can not speak to how well the perform with 4 heads. We have been quiet pleased with the units we have been running for the better part of a decade. These units can also be configured with a square fold if needed.

 

[Dan2122]

I think we’re happy to do offiline. 16 sheets of 80gsm and one cover of 250gsm a3 down to a4 is the plan

 

[Ynot_UK]

I think we’re happy to do offiline. 16 sheets of 80gsm and one cover of 250gsm a3 down to a4 is the plan

any particular reason why you need 4 staples as opposed to 2?

 

[Dan2122]

They’re books for young people, and sometimes the two staples are just not strong enough….

 

[Ynot_UK]

They’re books for young people, and sometimes the two staples are just not strong enough….

perhaps an alternative form of binding to saddle stitching may be more suitable?

 

[Dan2122]

perhaps an alternative form of binding to saddle stitching may be more suitable?

Really difficult to please everyone. We used to perfect bind them, but then they didn’t lie flat so that was no good either…

 

[Ynot_UK]

We use continuous coil binding for lots of educational and process documents which need to survive rough handling, need to both lay flat and fold back on themselves.

 

[Dan2122]

We use continuous coil binding for lots of educational and process documents which need to survive rough handling, need to both lay flat and fold back on themselves.

yeah that would be nice, but puts the price over what schools are willing to pay for the type of books we're doing.

 

[Ynot_UK]

Is this the 64pp booklets you were talking about bringing inhouse with a Versant and Plock?

If you take the 4-head stitching with squareback solution you are considering, what is the full cost of doing that?
If the staples are on OEM cartridges (as opposed to cheap strips of Rapid), how much per book is the stitching consumables cost?
How many books are you making in a month?

If you put a 10mm coil with a 275GSM C1S backboard and a clear pvc front on, that will cost you circa 11p per unit
Refurbished Magnapunch 1 with 4:1 dieset £1,000
Finish+Crimp @Coil £500
Year one depreciation charge on those = £375
Finishing may take slightly longer, although a good operator on a Magna gets very quick with little if any wastage.

In respect of the price your schools are paying for the finished book, they are going to have to pay more going forward with yet another paper price increase imminent. You must be able to work 11p into the mix...

 

[bcr]

Is this the 64pp booklets you were talking about bringing inhouse with a Versant and Plock?

If you take the 4-head stitching with squareback solution you are considering, what is the full cost of doing that?
If the staples are on OEM cartridges (as opposed to cheap strips of Rapid), how much per book is the stitching consumables cost?
How many books are you making in a month?

If you put a 10mm coil with a 275GSM C1S backboard and a clear pvc front on, that will cost you circa 11p per unit
Refurbished Magnapunch 1 with 4:1 dieset £1,000
Finish+Crimp @Coil £500
Year one depreciation charge on those = £375
Finishing may take slightly longer, although a good operator on a Magna gets very quick with little if any wastage.

In respect of the price your schools are paying for the finished book, they are going to have to pay more going forward with yet another paper price increase imminent. You must be able to work 11p into the mix...

You could also get a GBC inline punch on a machine if you're doing a lot of bound documents that way.. the latest ones on some machines will do 2 punches per page meaning you can still impose onto a sheet and punch at the same time

 

[jwheeler]

Hi does anyone know of a booklet maker that will fix 4 staples, Sadlestich?

Also does a squareback folder make your booklets stronger? Seeing as the staples are then not on the crease?

Cheers

Konica Minolta sells an in-line booklet maker called the SD-513 that does exactly this. We have it on our C6085 and it's quite useful for 2-up 8.5x5.5 booklets. It also creases the fold, applies a squareback, and trims all 3 sides for a full bleed booklet.

If you're looking for an offline unit, then check out the Morgana BM3035 or 3050 by Plockmatic Group. This unit is also available in-line with just about every vendor's digital press. It can do 4 staples (I think it even has the option to do 6 staples) and it will squareback the spine. You can often find these used on various auction sites as well. It comes in a hand-fed version or auto feed from drawers. The PowerSquare that others mentioned is a beast of a unit and a big step up from the Morgana in both size and cost...overkill for what you're doing.

 

[tdbb]

If you are looking for something with a smaller foot print and not so heavy duty we have a Nagel Foldnak 4. The automatic towers that we have that go with it only support 8 sheets but the staple folder can take bigger books they just have to be handfed. The unit is currently only setup for 2 heads, but can be configured to 4 heads.