Acrobat (and PitStop) User Interface

[Purple Cat]

I'm glad that Enfocus was there to fill the gaps, but having to pay extra for that functionality is kinda' like having to pay extra for the tires and steering wheel on your car.

Even though I'm biased, I don't think that's a fair comparison. PDF was not made for editing at all, the fact that you can edit it - certainly to the extent possible with PitStop - is not a trivial thing. If I take your car metaphor, I would compare it to having the ability to make your car fly. And that I think would be an option (one I would like in fact).

No, PitStop Professional doesn't come cheap. Are you saying it doesn't save you more money than you spent on it?

PurpleCat, sorry haven't upgraded PitStop beyond version 7 yet, and I haven't looked into Neo. Is there a demo on Neo? I'm not sure that I could sell that price tag.

Absolutely there is, 30 day trial version downloadable straight from the Enfocus website.

Take care,
David.

 

[Joe]

I guess my big request (to go along with the others already mentioned) would be to incorporate the separation preview into the document window or toolbar if we can make the toolbar universal. Or maybe like the pages, layer, etc tabs down the left side of the document window.

One ongoing problem I have with separation preview is that I like to leave it open because I view hundreds of different PDF's per day and I don't like turning it on and off that many times. After so long of a time I'll invariably run across a PDF that has different separations than the one I just closed but the separation preview does not update to show the new/different separations in the present file. If you click to turn off one of the separations you are guaranteed to get an Acrobat crash. Every time. If I notice the separation preview didn't refresh I can close the separation preview window and reopen it and that forces a refresh. Then it works okay but once you forget to manually refresh it between page views trash you are assured of a crash the next time you click the box to turn a sep off. Restart Acrobat and it usually works fine. The problem worsens over time until I have to trash the Acrobat prefs. That seems to resolve the situation for awhile but it eventually comes back. I've had this issue in version 7, 8, and 9. Never had it in 6. 7 was the worst. 8 was better than 7 and so far 9 is better than 8 but I still get it sometimes.

 

[almaink]

One real big issue I'd like to see fixed is the way Acrobat's caches are used. There needs to be a way to flush those caches, without having to quit and re start it, as after a while they bring the application down. Various warnings are given like " Acrobat can't read this document", even tho it's already open and edits have been done. Most times the PDF's that cause this are from Quark or Publisher if thats any help...

 

[leonardr]

The Preserve Black refers to R=G=B, doesn't it? I don't understand the Promote Gray function. That's one that I'm trying to find documentation on. On the surface it sounds counter to what I want. I actually want the reverse - I want CMYK Black to be treated as Grayscale.

Preserve Black means that it will ensure that when converting CMYK->CMYK, where the value is [0 0 0 K], that the resultant color is also [0 0 0 K'] (not necessarily the same K, since the profile ,may be doing GCR/UCR, etc.).

Promote Gray is exactly what it says - convert from grayscale (DeviceGray, in PDF language) to DeviceCMYK ([0 0 0 K]).

 

[leonardr]

One real big issue I'd like to see fixed is the way Acrobat's caches are used. There needs to be a way to flush those caches, without having to quit and re start it, as after a while they bring the application down.

We believe our cache architecture, in Acrobat 9, is "top notch" and go through VERY rigorous stress testing. If you can demonstrate a reproducable situation that can clearly demonstrate a problem with our caches - I'd like to know about it.

Various warnings are given like " Acrobat can't read this document", even tho it's already open and edits have been done. Most times the PDF's that cause this are from Quark or Publisher if thats any help...

Again, if you can give me a reproducable case - I'd love to hear it!

Leonard

 

[Vee]

Wow.... with all of these great features listed - we just gave Adobe two, maybe three more PAID UPGRADES!! GREAT!!

 

[jbbbarr]

Even more justification for Neo, it can do all this and more than Adobe will ever include. Just add up the costs from v7-v9 + pitstop. Almost exactly the same, and still waaaay behind in functionality. Wonder if this is part of the plan.

 

[almaink]

Leonard perhaps it is in version 9, but it was and still is an issue in earlier versions of Acrobat. Although I have version 9 here, it's to new IMO to be using in production yet unless Adobe's willing to cover lost time caused by unknown bugs. Version 7 is still the production standard here and I'm kinda pissed that it was never fixed completely, but instead new untested versions come out. Version 8 has got to be one of the biggest POS Adobe ever released. WTF can't Adobe just fix an application instead of releasing new versions all the time? I know thats been SOP for Adobe for years now to do this, but who came up with this idea marketing? I never could grasp the concept of fixing a version completely. Seems like we just get used to a version, all the bugs are just about fixed, then bang, a new version comes out with new issues to deal with. Nice way for Adobe to line it's pockets, but it's one of the biggest problems in the printing world. We end up with so many versions out there now God only knows what version the next job will be done in that we need to support. Opening old versions is new versions can also be a problem so IMO thats a last ditch resort and sometimes a crap shoot at best. Sorry to rant, but this has been galling me for a long time now.

 

[rich apollo]

Whoa there, Alma. Keep this thread civil. Leonard is being decent enough to listen to us, we can be respectful.

 

[rich apollo]

Preserve Black means that it will ensure that when converting CMYK->CMYK, where the value is [0 0 0 K], that the resultant color is also [0 0 0 K'] (not necessarily the same K, since the profile ,may be doing GCR/UCR, etc.).

I'll get back to you on this one.

Promote Gray is exactly what it says - convert from grayscale (DeviceGray, in PDF language) to DeviceCMYK ([0 0 0 K]).

I'm missing something. I don't understand why I would want that.

 

[rich apollo]

6 - Again, the Object Touchup tool allows this since Acrobat 7. What are we missing?
7 - Can you be more specific? What particular feature(s) of "Global Change" would you like to see?
Leonard

I was playing with this in Acrobat 9 - I don't see how you can specify a CMYK tint.

Global Change I mostly use for color edits - you'd be surprised how often folks will use 100%C, 100%M, 100%Y, 100%K or "Registration" as colors in artwork. I use it for font substitution as well.

 

[leonardr]

I was playing with this in Acrobat 9 - I don't see how you can specify a CMYK tint.

You can't pick a specific color, but you can color convert it to a particular profile.

Global Change I mostly use for color edits - you'd be surprised how often folks will use 100%C, 100%M, 100%Y, 100%K or "Registration" as colors in artwork. I use it for font substitution as well.

You can do both of these today with Preflight 9.

 

[rich apollo]

You can't pick a specific color, but you can color convert it to a particular profile.

I need to be able to specify exact color values - like 100% black, or values to match a CT, or to set up a rich black, et cetera. Also, need to be able to control overprints.

You can do both of these today with Preflight 9.

Preflight Profiles can't be dynamic, can they?

 

[Joe]

I need to be able to specify exact color values - like 100% black, or values to match a CT, or to set up a rich black, et cetera. Also, need to be able to control overprints.

Preflight Profiles can't be dynamic, can they?

Sounds just like...Pitstop.

 

[leonardr]

I need to be able to specify exact color values - like 100% black, or values to match a CT, or to set up a rich black, et cetera. Also, need to be able to control overprints.

No problem - all that is possible with Preflight 9. Check out all the various new Fixes.

Preflight Profiles can't be dynamic, can they?

What do you mean by "dynamic", in this case?

 

[Vee]

Whoa there, Alma. Keep this thread civil. Leonard is being decent enough to listen to us, we can be respectful.

I don't think that his comments were out of line, they were very real world. Funny how TRUTH, is so "scary".
The very unfortunate thing is, his concerns as a paying customer were not addressed.

You guys can BS over features all day and night - how about addressing the big issue here??

"can't Adobe just fix an application instead of releasing new versions all the time? I know thats been SOP for Adobe for years now to do this, but who came up with this idea marketing? I never could grasp the concept of fixing a version completely. Seems like we just get used to a version, all the bugs are just about fixed, then bang, a new version comes out with new issues to deal with. Nice way for Adobe to line it's pockets, but it's one of the biggest problems in the printing world."

Best,
Vee

 

[leonardr]

You guys can BS over features all day and night - how about addressing the big issue here??

"can't Adobe just fix an application instead of releasing new versions all the time? I know thats been SOP for Adobe for years now to do this, but who came up with this idea marketing? I never could grasp the concept of fixing a version completely. Seems like we just get used to a version, all the bugs are just about fixed, then bang, a new version comes out with new issues to deal with. Nice way for Adobe to line it's pockets, but it's one of the biggest problems in the printing world."

Adobe releases new version every 18-24 months or so, which is actually a pretty long time in the software industry today. Look at web browsers and email clients with updates every few months (or less!) - even operating system updates are running about 12-18 months (on average).

No one forces you to upgrade your software. You are welcome to continue to use whatever version(s) makes your happy and enables you to do your job. We still see/hear from users running Acrobat 5...

Leonard

 

[Vee]

Adobe releases new version every 18-24 months or so, which is actually a pretty long time in the software industry today. Look at web browsers and email clients with updates every few months (or less!) - even operating system updates are running about 12-18 months (on average).

No one forces you to upgrade your software. You are welcome to continue to use whatever version(s) makes your happy and enables you to do your job. We still see/hear from users running Acrobat 5...

Leonard

I think we are addressing the issue of not just software & updates, but software & updates in the printing world... being that this site is focused on printing. I could care less how often a web app or email client is updated, but software to be used for production is another story. Same for OS updates.

No, we may not be "forced" to update when a new version is crammed down our throats by the big sw companies. But those little guys called customers are hard to say no to. It makes for a difficult position, when they have version 85 of said program, and the printer has only updated to version 83!

FWIW, Acrobat 8 is such a piece I haven't even considered 9.

Vee

 

[Lukas Engqvist]

I know this will sound a bit like "selling your soul to the d" but I really recommend the Adobe Partner program, the fees for ASN is really well spent in webinars, and software. I have my membership fees, get the one licence / platform and that way can evaluate if the uppgrade is worthwhile for all operators.
In the printing industry the Adobe software costs ar much less than Agfa, Kodak or Fuji, with often more issues less fixes more bells and whistles. For the person who invests in learning the new features the time saved in the end is emense.
In Acrobat 8 and 9 we are movinig to APPE (Adobe Pdf Print Engine) a much awaited step technology. It works well, yes there are things to take care of, and things being taken care of. Adobe does listen if you are specific.
Logg the errors and they will fix them.
"can't Adobe just fix an application instead of releasing new versions all the time?"
specific problems can be solved general feelings are harder.

Remember reading some published pitstop loggs from aircrafts.
one entry said: something loose in cockpit
next entry: something tightened in cockpit
You ask for something to be fixed and "something" will be fixed, not necessaryily the same "something".

No one is forced to move on with backwards compatible standards. Stick to PDFx1a if you want to timecapsule your production flow.

 

[selectset]

Does Acrobat 9 have the ability to convert one spot color to another?

In Acrobat 8, we would use the convert colors and select one pms and use the convert to another pms that is in the document. I have gone through Acrobat 9 and i can not find this option under the convert colors.