CMYK to Pantone converter

Ok this is throwing in a problem at a late stage…*but it is possible to use Lab values in InDesign and then convert to the output intent using PDFx1a…which would theoretically give closest match. I used to do this even to export to PDFx4 until I found I had problems with this on gradients fading to paper, because the paper (0% colour) also got defined as Lab, which in the RIP would try to match resulting in full Spot colours benefiting but gradients fading to paper messing the whole thing up.
Today I use the Pantone bridge (coated and uncoated) look at the application values, some times also use colourshopX (on G5 and older computer) and often a little common sense (aka experienced intelligent guess) to, if possible keep the number of primary colours down to a minimum. (If time permits and the intention is to determine, company brand colours I'll try sneak some swatches in a gutter of some job on a similar stock)

I think the problem I'm seeing from the dumb guy perspective is that PS is doing it correctly without any intervention from th euser but ID and AI are not. This is typical Adobe and is oneof the reasons that graphics has such issues as color repeatability.

This type of lousy programmming is one of the reasons that for the graphics dollar espeically in art or signage i recommend not using Adobe.
 
I disagree that it's an Adobe problem, (remember Adobe also was the creator of PS, that's how they started) the problem is more in the nature of keeping colour at a high level of abstraction and then landing it without crashing it. It is just another case of flexibility versus simplicity. I do not agree that the PS process makes things more repeatable. If you want colour repeatability to span materials and techniques then properly managed colour is far superior, provided you know what you want, especially as we consider a world where many of the output devices are LCDs as in touchpads and smatphones. As technology changes we need to work out how to handle it. To know and understand the limits, preferably before they cause us a problem.

The biggest problem is actually knowing what is expected, and that is why I say the Pantone Bridge is the number one tool (coated and uncoated versions) Clients need to be able to talk about their needs without it getting too abstract. Workflows can be configured in many ways, but unless we know clearly what we are aiming at we will never hit it. Adobe has given us alternative paths and you can create your own swatch book if you are not pleased with the ones that are included. Even LAB values are limited as you need to decide if you want to convert the spectral values at 5000k (industry standard viewing) or 6500k (Adobe RGB), for some colours this will have more of an impact than others. If pantone was to give a full rendering we would have a spectral table for each pantone colour at each substrate, and this is just not reasonable, so there are some compromises made, and most users will, for the most part manage fine.
 
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I disagree that it's an Adobe problem, (remember Adobe also was the creator of PS, that's how they started) the problem is more in the nature of keeping colour at a high level of abstraction and then landing it without crashing it. It is just another case of flexibility versus simplicity. I do not agree that the PS process makes things more repeatable. If you want colour repeatability to span materials and techniques then properly managed colour is far superior, provided you know what you want, especially as we consider a world where many of the output devices are LCDs as in touchpads and smatphones. As technology changes we need to work out how to handle it. To know and understand the limits, preferably before they cause us a problem.

The biggest problem is actually knowing what is expected, and that is why I say the Pantone Bridge is the number one tool (coated and uncoated versions) Clients need to be able to talk about their needs without it getting too abstract. Workflows can be configured in many ways, but unless we know clearly what we are aiming at we will never hit it. Adobe has given us alternative paths and you can create your own swatch book if you are not pleased with the ones that are included. Even LAB values are limited as you need to decide if you want to convert the spectral values at 5000k (industry standard viewing) or 6500k (Adobe RGB), for some colours this will have more of an impact than others. If pantone was to give a full rendering we would have a spectral table for each pantone colour at each substrate, and this is just not reasonable, so there are some compromises made, and most users will, for the most part manage fine.

Lukas by PS I meant PhotoShop, PS is doing it right and AI IAdobe Illustrator)and ID (InDesign) are doing it wrong. Well not wrong but the old way. Now you can't create spot color in PS anbd convert to CMYK in PS and place in Ai or ID alongside the same spot and convert with the same result.

This is lame even CorelDRAw does it correctly
 
AI and InD can use either the LAB values or CMYK tables, the user decides. What colour settings are you using when the programs do it "wrong" for you? (Note that with InDesign the first instance of a spot colour will define the (CMYK) values for that colour, even if the object that brought it to InDesign is deleted, after.) The system is not fool proof, but flexible AND predictable.
 
AI and InD can use either the LAB values or CMYK tables, the user decides. What colour settings are you using when the programs do it "wrong" for you? (Note that with InDesign the first instance of a spot colour will define the (CMYK) values for that colour, even if the object that brought it to InDesign is deleted, after.) The system is not fool proof, but flexible AND predictable.

I'll check it out in more detail but when I was testing yesturday I couldn't find any controls for this. May be old and blind. Using PC version CS5.
 
If a person - as the OP noted - is using Illustrator ...
Why wouldn't one just set the color profile for the output device desired
or color space desired
and
just use the built in script in Illustrator
to convert any CMYK value to the appropriate PMS color?
It gives the degree of accuracy - as others do.
-
Why over analyze and over criticize things
rather than just getting things done?

MSD
 
If a person - as the OP noted - is using Illustrator ...
Why wouldn't one just set the color profile for the output device desired
or color space desired
and
just use the built in script in Illustrator
to convert any CMYK value to the appropriate PMS color?
It gives the degree of accuracy - as others do.
-
Why over analyze and over criticize things
rather than just getting things done?

MSD

Actually the conversion was the other direction spot colot tp CMYK.

The problem seems to be that AI and ID while allowing you use the LAB color model it applies LAB numbers from the ols CMYK look up table which is not Pantone certified.

PhotoShop CS5 does it correctly as does CorelDRAW X5.
 
YOU say - "Actually the conversion was the other direction spot colot tp CMYK."

Please go back and read the posting

The name of the thread is - "CMYK to Pantone converter"

The OP says
"What i'm looking for is a way to convert the screen colours (CMYK) to print colours (Pantone)"

I may be mistaken - but ...
I think your complaining is getting in the way of the subject.

MSD
 
If you can't afford $80 for arguably the most important color tool a graphic designer will ever need, then please do us all a favor and stick to web design. You'll spend far more than $80 in color adjustment fees from your printer on your first job.

Get the Pantone Color Bridge or Solid to Process color imaging guide which shows the pantone swatch next to the CMYK equivalent. It's a real eye opener when you see the color shifts. You'll never design a piece using a CMYK orange again.

If you think you can cut corners on an industry standard that exists solely for the purpose of maintaining color consistency on press, you're drinking the bong water.

Just keepin' it real!

Edited by: LoweringTheBar on Jul 15, 2008 1:58 PM

Dude what's wrong with the BONG WATER?

Pantone IMO got this screwed up by not specing the LAB specification years ago. It's the best, as if that's good.

The problem I see is now we have some RIPs using a 5 year old, a three year old, (cmyk or RGB LUT spec) and now Pantone issues a LAB LUT spec. Adobe ignores it for Illustrator and InDesign but uses it for Photoshop, CorelDRAW follows the spec and about 90% of the RIPs for ink jets I've seen under 18 months old have adopted the new LAB spec.

Damn it's all over the place and will be that way for a few years. I moved to all application based LAB conversions for spot to CMYK or CMYK to Spot, in hopes of some sanity in my lifetime.
Now back to the BONG WATER>
 
YOU say - "Actually the conversion was the other direction spot colot tp CMYK."

Please go back and read the posting

The name of the thread is - "CMYK to Pantone converter"

The OP says
"What i'm looking for is a way to convert the screen colours (CMYK) to print colours (Pantone)"

I may be mistaken - but ...
I think your complaining is getting in the way of the subject.

MSD

You are correct I was mistaken however my experiments have shown the direction is irrelevant. Simply open Photoshop CS5 set the color management to you CMYK setting and build a file with the cmyk color select color libraries. PS will point to the propper (well sort of many choices are going to be not close) color using the most modern conversion method. You can also use CorelDRAW, do not use Illustrator or Indesign the conversions will be the old specifications.

The experiments have been useful as I have a client in Chicago with 35 systems and 8 printers who are experiencing spot color conversions issues do to many issues. I now know how to resolve them completely.

As far as complaining goes Adobe deserves it $1,200 for a screwed up graphics suite is not a laughing matterr
 
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