Goss Community issues

[Martin52ez]

Where to start .. having one heck of a time getting ink water balance down .. i have 2 years experience running this press i have never even seen a press before the day i have started i have some training about two weeks . Mostly learn as you go or ask the guy with 18 years experience who just does it or has the theory tighten it till it prints or tighten it till it cleans up .. this has caused me nothing but headaches day in and day out ... i have nightmares about what i will come back to after 2 to 3 days off . Any and ALL information i can get would be AWESOME !!!

Issues i have been having as of late

Ink in water trays behind water stops ( i have V cut them)
Water in ink fountain ( mostly the black)
press flings ink everywhere on the inside / on the guards


all i need is info and guidance to make my job not easier but less stressful all i really want to do is a decent job with low waste and less problems and a clean shop

 

[Deleted member 16349]

Issues i have been having as of late

Ink in water trays behind water stops ( i have V cut them)
Water in ink fountain ( mostly the black)
press flings ink everywhere on the inside / on the guards


all i need is info and guidance to make my job not easier but less stressful all i really want to do is a decent job with low waste and less problems and a clean shop

Of course a great amount of experience running a press and good inks etc. are very helpful with dealing with this balancing act but the fundamental cause of your problem is related to how the press is designed and unfortunately for you and others in the same situation, the press manufacturers do not want to correct this problem. They don't even want to understand it.

It also seems like your company does not want to invest in training and I am guessing a lot of other things to make the process work better.

Over correcting can be a cause of many problems on press. Hopefully some of the many experienced press operators on this forum can help you with some guidance.

 

[BeauchampT]

Well, that is one huge can of worms you just opened, but.....

The whole issue sounds as though you have a major incompatibility with your ink/fountain solution. But here are a few starting steps to prove it to your managers:
1) Ensure the press roller settings are at recommended settings (especially your form to plate and water system)
2) Measure the running temperatures of the rollers (are they consistent unit to unit, excessively high or low?)
3) Make sure your fountain solution is dosing according to the recommendation from the company (if they say 3%, run 3%, not 2 not 5....); also has the solution been replaced lately

If your manager/supervisor is still not convinced it is an ink issue, DOCUMENT!!! Take pictures of the different problems, track it for a few days, and then go to your manager/supervisor again. See if the visual evidence helps them to see the situation. AT the very least, having your ink maker come in and look at the problem will push in the right direction.

Hope you make some progress. IM me anytime you have problems to troubleshoot....

T

 

[Cornishpastythighs]

Dont forget Roller Durometers and roller care/conditioning.
Its tough being the only press operator who wants to do things right. You do in fact have 2 years and 2 weeks training.

 

[Martin52ez]

My manager has opened the books on cost the last year if we need it it is ordered from parts to rollers to new paper .. he finally has a person from US ink coming out to take a look at what we have going on . with the rollers settings i have a infrared Temp gauge Whats normal temperature ? i notice our ground pounders run cooler then the the 4 high ( its built like a DGM 430) its 4 communitys wacked and stacked .. roller settings are set every day i work i check and double check the whole press beginning of the day and at the end of the night while cleaning and inspecting blankets

 

[rich apollo]

Has this always been the way, or is this a new problem? Did something change?

 

[Martin52ez]

Has this always been the way, or is this a new problem? Did something change?

it seems as this summer has come along that it has changed we would get a little here and there but now in the black if you dont clean the water stop it really starts throwing ink

 

[D Ink Man]

WoOW! The same reply fits perfectly right here also! What a country!



Have your ink and/or fountain solution provider(s) perform a laboratory ink and fount study.

This can be performed on a Duke Emulsification tester or even more elaborate, Lithotronic tester from Novomatics.

This will tell you exactly (particularly the Lithotronic) the ink and water emulsifying properties interactions between your ink and fountain solution. It would be my guess that any ink company worth their salt will know exactly what I am referring to. The fount supplier should also.

Any printer that employs a Goss Metroliner as part of their arsenal of printing machines, deserve the SERVICE of these two consumable suppliers, particulary the ink fellows.

Hopefully you are not involved with an accountant (bean counter) at your establishment that is focused only on the 'selling price' of the ink. This a MAJOR mistake for the well being and profitability of your company. Cheapest is seldom the best when all factors are put into the final equation. And that you can take as gospel.

I am going to take a SWAG, and predict that you are using either Sun Chemical, Hostmann Steinberg Flint, or INX process inks. That order is generally the lowest priced to the highest in my experience.

One last thing. My opinion is that Flint Group makes the best Web printing ink in the United States of America, based on performance, competitive pricing and technical servicing (that which is left of the back burnered missing link). This is true for the available commercial printing ink offerings available.

D Ink Man

 

[rich apollo]

Did they update the software on the press console? I've seen that put in sub-optimal ink and water curves.

D Ink Man's suggestion is good. Contact the ink vendor - maybe they changed the varnish package.

Did you change plates? We had some plates that were grained in such a way that they had a very narrow window for water. If you ran them where they looked wet you were emulsified.

The good news is that it sounds like there was an event that changed the press' behavior. Now you just have get someone to admit it.

 

[BeauchampT]

Interesting that you mention summer...

I am with everyone else, if your settings are good, it is more than likely the ink. If your manager doesn't mind spending the money, get a better ink. Get the company to come ina nd look closely at the situation. And if they tell you it is anything other than their ink, call in a different manufacturer

T