Opening PDF files in Illustrator

[David Milisock]

Ok I need to know what to do so that Illustrator users that have Acrobat DO NOT open PDF files in Illustrator? I cannot find a way to lock out AI and still give us output capabilities. Any suggestions besides stringing up the user by the thumbs.

 

[gordo]

Ok I need to know what to do so that Illustrator users that have Acrobat DO NOT open PDF files in Illustrator? I cannot find a way to lock out AI and still give us output capabilities. Any suggestions besides stringing up the user by the thumbs.

Would exporting it as PNG instead of PDF work for you?

 

[Dov Isaacs]

Ok I need to know what to do so that Illustrator users that have Acrobat DO NOT open PDF files in Illustrator? I cannot find a way to lock out AI and still give us output capabilities. Any suggestions besides stringing up the user by the thumbs.

You can conceivably use PDF protection to prevent the Illustrator from being used as a PDF editor, making it non-editable unless a password was provided. However, that would prevent you from creating PDF/X since the PDF/X standards do not permit PDF protections to be applied. (In theory, this could have be allowed in the PDF/X specifications, but the “print industry” felt that even simple protections such as not allowing editing would make PDF usage too inconvenient for them.) And you really do want to use PDF/X (and in particular PDF/X-4) for PDF print publishing workflows!

Unfortunately, the only remedy for the problem of users, including prepress professionals who should know better, opening PDF files in Illustrator is (1) education and (2) a “written” (in e-mail) warning with every PDF file you send that opening a PDF file in Illustrator is a lossy operation that could corrupt the contents.

FWIW, the same issue is associated with users opening PDF files in Photoshop. I've recently heard of some prepress operator who takes every PDF file exported from InDesign and opens same in Photoshop, resaving as a PDF file from Photoshop and printing that, then complaining about spot color and quality issues!

- Dov

 

[gordo]

You can conceivably use PDF protection to prevent the Illustrator from being used as a PDF editor, making it non-editable unless a password was provided. However, that would prevent you from creating PDF/X since the PDF/X standards do not permit PDF protections to be applied. (In theory, this could have be allowed in the PDF/X specifications, but the “print industry” felt that even simple protections such as not allowing editing would make PDF usage too inconvenient for them.) And you really do want to use PDF/X (and in particular PDF/X-4) for PDF print publishing workflows!

Unfortunately, the only remedy for the problem of users, including prepress professionals who should know better, opening PDF files in Illustrator is (1) education and (2) a “written” (in e-mail) warning with every PDF file you send that opening a PDF file in Illustrator is a lossy operation that could corrupt the contents.

FWIW, the same issue is associated with users opening PDF files in Photoshop. I've recently heard of some prepress operator who takes every PDF file exported from InDesign and opens same in Photoshop, resaving as a PDF file from Photoshop and printing that, then complaining about spot color and quality issues!

- Dov

Why not include the option to lock the PDF contents requiring a password to enable editing but not viewing and simply include a warning that doing enabling protection means the PDF is no longer PDF/X sanctioned (as far as that aspect is concerned)?

 

[Joe]

You can conceivably use PDF protection to prevent the Illustrator from being used as a PDF editor, making it non-editable unless a password was provided. However, that would prevent you from creating PDF/X since the PDF/X standards do not permit PDF protections to be applied. (In theory, this could have be allowed in the PDF/X specifications, but the “print industry” felt that even simple protections such as not allowing editing would make PDF usage too inconvenient for them.) And you really do want to use PDF/X (and in particular PDF/X-4) for PDF print publishing workflows!

Unfortunately, the only remedy for the problem of users, including prepress professionals who should know better, opening PDF files in Illustrator is (1) education and (2) a “written” (in e-mail) warning with every PDF file you send that opening a PDF file in Illustrator is a lossy operation that could corrupt the contents.

FWIW, the same issue is associated with users opening PDF files in Photoshop. I've recently heard of some prepress operator who takes every PDF file exported from InDesign and opens same in Photoshop, resaving as a PDF file from Photoshop and printing that, then complaining about spot color and quality issues!

- Dov

I know a lot of designers that receive ads in PDF format and the first thing they do is open them in Photoshop and save as a jpeg because 10 years ago they had a problem with a PDF and it fixed it back then (though of course it wasn't fixing it properly back then either) so it must be the right thing to do. Adobe never should have allowed PDF's to be opened with Photoshop. Or Illustrator unless it was a PDF saved from Illustrator. And even then only if the user would have all the fonts in the PDF installed on their computer.

And while I'm thinking about...why let Photoshop do text? It's a photo editor. Not a page layout application. Stringing up the user by the thumbs though would be a great option.

 

[Danny Whitehead]

I know a lot of designers that receive ads in PDF format and the first thing they do is open them in Photoshop and save as a jpeg because 10 years ago they had a problem with a PDF and it fixed it back then (though of course it wasn't fixing it properly back then either) so it must be the right thing to do. Adobe never should have allowed PDF's to be opened with Photoshop. Or Illustrator unless it was a PDF saved from Illustrator. And even then only if the user would have all the fonts in the PDF installed on their computer.

And while I'm thinking about...why let Photoshop do text? It's a photo editor. Not a page layout application. Stringing up the user by the thumbs though would be a great option.

There are plenty of legitimate reasons to rasterise a PDF or set text in Photoshop. And there are plenty of reasons to crack into a PDF with Illy, most of them in less than ideal circumstances, and I'm not talking prepress fixups. If you took out every frequently misused features out of Adobe software, there wouldn't be much left.

 

[Joe]

There are plenty of legitimate reasons to rasterise a PDF or set text in Photoshop. And there are plenty of reasons to crack into a PDF with Illy, most of them in less than ideal circumstances, and I'm not talking prepress fixups. If you took out every frequently misused features out of Adobe software, there wouldn't be much left.

We'll just have to agree to disagree on this subject. Edit a PDF in Photoshop or set text? Never for print production. Edit a PDF in Illustrator? Only as Dov outlined above.

 

[Possumgal]

Hey, for some cash-strapped smaller places who are never going to see Pitstop or the like, sometimes Illy is the only way to go. Photoshop? Never.

 

[Stephen Marsh]

Hey, for some cash-strapped smaller places who are never going to see Pitstop or the like, sometimes Illy is the only way to go. Photoshop? Never.

That’s the crazy thing, they will spend tens, hundreds of thousands of dollars dealing with lost productivity trying to move 50gig files around, when having the proper tools only costs fractions of that. Go figure. I think we have all been there and done that with employers that can’t see the wood for the trees. The cost of PitStop is obvious to them, but the cost of lost productivity and productive hours is not. Now that PitStop can be purchased via subscription, the old argument about capital expenditure is no longer valid, it is now an operational cost like paying the phone or power bill.


Stephen Marsh

 

[Joe]

Hey, for some cash-strapped smaller places who are never going to see Pitstop or the like, sometimes Illy is the only way to go. Photoshop? Never.

I'm sorry. It is the PDF age. If printers can't afford the cost of Pitstop maybe they shouldn't be in business.

 

[AP90]

All I will say is there is more than one way to skin a cat (I prefer to say deer as I'm a hunter lol). And some of those ways are wrong will take more time. But you are either happy with the way your doing it and everything works out good, or you find another way to do it. Honestly, if your a smaller shop, chances are a lot of your customers are going to be happy with whatever your going to be giving them. If its a corporation or local high end business, they're going to want everything perfect, but charities that put out posters for events, business cards, postcards, etc, if you can get away with doing things how you want to and save a few bucks, I say go for it. Im sure RR Donnelly isn't opening PDFs in Illy, but if the places had the revenue of RR, I'm sure they wouldn't either. For some of us small places, we do what we can to get the job done.

 

[Joe]

In the grand scheme of prepress tools Pitstop is about the cheapest thing out there. $800 US.

 

[Danny Whitehead]

We'll just have to agree to disagree on this subject. Edit a PDF in Photoshop or set text? Never for print production. Edit a PDF in Illustrator? Only as Dov outlined above.

I'm not just talking about print production. For instance, a designer might take a PDF of a design into Photoshop to make a visual mockup. They might want to apply an effect to type that vector applications can't do. They might have to rasterise something for a website. They might, having failed all attempts at getting the client to supply a vector logo, prize one out of a PDF using Illustrator. Adobe shouldn't remove this functionality just because it's misused by a few prepress cowboys.

 

[Joe]

It comes down to the right tool for the right job. And it isn't "prepress cowboys" doing it wrong. It is designers. I know Adobe is never going to remove that functionality but from a prepress standpoint it would make life easier if designers didn't have access to those kinds of functions for their "PRINT" jobs. Everytime a PDF is opened in Photoshop and rasterized for a print job a kitten dies somewhere.

 

[shorty83]

I have to open all PDF files in Illustrator because I use Esko Deskpak (basically Illustrator Plug ins). What is the big deal about opening PDF file in Illustrator? I don't have any issues doing this.

 

[AP90]

I have to open all PDF files in Illustrator because I use Esko Deskpak (basically Illustrator Plug ins). What is the big deal about opening PDF file in Illustrator? I don't have any issues doing this.

Honestly, I would venture to say that there isn't any issue doing this, but it's not the way it's "supposed to be done". I mean seriously, if opening a pdf in illustrator was such a big deal and created so many problems, why does it work out for so many people?

 

[Macmann]

Go easy on 'em Dov.

 

[Danny Whitehead]

It comes down to the right tool for the right job. And it isn't "prepress cowboys" doing it wrong. It is designers. I know Adobe is never going to remove that functionality but from a prepress standpoint it would make life easier if designers didn't have access to those kinds of functions for their "PRINT" jobs. Everytime a PDF is opened in Photoshop and rasterized for a print job a kitten dies somewhere.

It would make life easier if people that misuse any tool didn't have access to it. Doesn't mean you should cripple the tools. If you're still denying any legitimate uses for these functions, your loss.

 

[Joe]

There really is no loss on my part. I just do it with Acrobat using either Edit Image or Edit Object and open the image in Photoshop or the text/vector in Illustrator or fix it with Pitstop or God forbid a last resort....have customers re-send corrected PDF's which is rarely needed with the tools available today. And this a print forum after all so I am talking about print production.

As far as your argument of:

For instance, a designer might take a PDF of a design into Photoshop to make a visual mockup. They might want to apply an effect to type that vector applications can't do. They might have to rasterise something for a website. They might, having failed all attempts at getting the client to supply a vector logo, prize one out of a PDF using Illustrator. Adobe shouldn't remove this functionality just because it's misused by a few prepress cowboys.

Yes you can do everyone of them as described. There are also better ways to do all of them.

 

[Tim-Ellis]

I have to open all PDF files in Illustrator because I use Esko Deskpak (basically Illustrator Plug ins). What is the big deal about opening PDF file in Illustrator? I don't have any issues doing this.

Hello Shorty83,

Oh you've gone and done it now....

http://prepression.blogspot.co.uk/20...ts-of-pdf.html

In short Illustrator can make loads of changes to the artwork (CMYK values in particular) in the background without telling you.

It depends on the work you are printing.

If the PDF was created in Illustrator and saved as a Illustrator Default PDF you should be ok.

A lot of the work I do is Black variable data so not a lot can go wrong (and the bits that do are easy to spot and correct)

Read up on the subject and have a think about the artwork you handle and check out if it's effected or not.