KM 6100 and 3070 print too red

[jdalsvig]

I've got a problem with the Konica Minolta C6100 and C3070, using Fiery Command Workstation - they print a certain CMYK formula (100, 89, 31,35) too red. To the point where it is purple, not blue. This CMYK was a color choice to substitute for PANTONE 282C. All print vendors that print orders are sent to do not have this problem with this CMYK number - as to be expected their blues are inconsistent from shop to shop, but they are blue not purple. PANTONE spot blues don't have this problem, even this CMYK number when converted to and exported as an RGB is closer to 282C when printed. This problem gets worse when those CMYK numbers are applied to a transparency or gradient.

Calibrations are regularly performed, calibrations specific to stock are performed.

Anyone know why this is happening? Anyone having this same problem? Any solutions?
Example attached - the image one left is before prepress adjustment for color, the print on the right is after.

 

[kslight]

I just grabbed my swatch book, and even 282cp (what my Pantone swatch suggests for 282c is 100, 90, 13, 68), looks like a dark purple to my eyes.

I’m not trying to be snarky but I’m not surprised that your color build comes out purple….there is a lot of magenta in it.

I had a Konica 6085 and it did lean red though. Try different profiles…Coated vs uncoated, etc, or just creating a profile specific to this project, probably a better bet than shifting the machine’s overall color if everything you print is fine except this. Sometimes I switched profiles or disabled the color management on the fiery job itself for different customers.


There is also a process color adjustment I remember in the advanced menu on the printer somewhere…sometimes this utility helped me.

 

[jwheeler]

A few ideas to try:

1. Do you open the PDF, then print to hold, or do you drag/drop the PDF directly into CWS? Printing from Acrobat can alter the colors, so if you're doing that, just drop the PDF in directly,
2. If the sections in question are vector, you can use the "Substitute Colors" feature in CWS. In this feature, you tell it the CMYK values that you want to alter, then input the values you want it to change to. In your case, reducing the Magenta will probably do the trick.
3. You can use the "ImageViewer Curves" feature in CWS to make a quick adjustment like you would in Photoshop.
4. Lastly, you could just try using a different color source setting <---this simple step often resolves the problem

 

[bertman98]

i think if you make the differance between cyan and magenta wider, ie close to 30 percent it will be less purple

 

[TicketsandBadges.com]

I've had this issue with my 3070 many times. I finally ended up going into command workstation, into the job properties, then go to color...where it says CYMK you have a bunch of choices,

Bypass Conversion
ColorWise Off
DIC (EFI)
GRACCoL 2013
Japan Color

Etc,

Start trying all of the choices in there, one at a time. Print a sheet (write on it what the setting is) and then try another. Then another. Remember where you started but I (depending on the job) have had pretty good success in messing around in there.

 

[jdalsvig]

i think if you make the differance between cyan and magenta wider, ie close to 30 percent it will be less purple

Hi bertman98,
You are correct. I use action lists in pitstop to change the CMYK values. The problem with this is that every file requires pre-press time and it can add up to a lot of time fixing a problem that shouldn't be there (this is a University print shop that prints this same color on everything).
Thanks for your help!

 

[jdalsvig]

I've had this issue with my 3070 many times. I finally ended up going into command workstation, into the job properties, then go to color...where it says CYMK you have a bunch of choices,

Bypass Conversion
ColorWise Off
DIC (EFI)
GRACCoL 2013
Japan Color

Etc,

Start trying all of the choices in there, one at a time. Print a sheet (write on it what the setting is) and then try another. Then another. Remember where you started but I (depending on the job) have had pretty good success in messing around in there.

Hi,
Bypass conversion is what is used on the 6100, GRACol on the 3070. This helps a bit, but does not get rid of the problem.
I use action lists in pitstop to change the CMYK values. The problem with this is that every file requires pre-press time and it can add up to a lot of time fixing a problem that shouldn't be there (this is a University print shop that prints this same color on everything).
Thanks for your help!

 

[jdalsvig]

A few ideas to try:

1. Do you open the PDF, then print to hold, or do you drag/drop the PDF directly into CWS? Printing from Acrobat can alter the colors, so if you're doing that, just drop the PDF in directly,
2. If the sections in question are vector, you can use the "Substitute Colors" feature in CWS. In this feature, you tell it the CMYK values that you want to alter, then input the values you want it to change to. In your case, reducing the Magenta will probably do the trick.
3. You can use the "ImageViewer Curves" feature in CWS to make a quick adjustment like you would in Photoshop.
4. Lastly, you could just try using a different color source setting <---this simple step often resolves the problem

Hi jwheeler,
1. pdfs are dragged and dropped.
2. Substitute Colors has been tried, but has problems if there are transparencies, live text, gradients or drop shadows over the color to be corrected. It changes color but is not a solution. I use pitstop in acrobat to create action lists that change the problem cmyk numbers to something that prints closer to the PANTONE color they are supposed to "match" (282C). This is a big help, but it takes up a lot more time in pre-press than what should be necessary. FYI - this color is used constantly for print jobs at this shop.
3. Image viewer curves can help, but every file needs a different setting. I'm looking for a fix that doesn't require this - there other printers we outsource to that have no problems with these CMYK numbers turning purple. I have not gotten any answers as to what they are doing that would solve the problem.
4. Color Source setting is used - Bypass conversion for the 6100 and GRACol for the 3070 - it helps but does not solve the problem.

Thanks for your time! If you have any other ideas please share.

 

[namelessentity]

I would just leave the color called out as 282C and use Fiery Spot on to color match the swatch. Should only take a few minutes.

 

[Organic_nature]

Minolta user for 4 years here. Was 3070, now 6085, color science/toners is the same.
Minolta tend to be more red than Xerox.

Ok, my workaround - I made simple default colour curve in ColorCentro (native minolta app), with -10% magenta (from top right coner) and +2% cyan,
saved that as default tone curve
Most of the time i use Euroscale coated v2
So on around 95% jobs is very close to offset press