EskoArtworks, Equinox?

[gordo]

Apparently Hexachrome was discontinued in 2008?

I believe that it was actually discontinued years before that. But some printers/prepress shops still have the software. It's also become a generic term for any 6/c process that uses orange and green to extend the gamut. There's big H and little h Hexachrome. Big h means that the official cmykog ink hues are being used and one can reference the Hexachrome swatchbook for the screen tint builds they create. With raster images you tended to get candyfloss color. Quite artificial looking. Little h means the the conventional cmyk inks are used and the o and g may or may not be the official hues.
BTW the Hexachrome swatch book was printed using Staccato FM, which means that many of the screen tint colors would not be reproducible with AM screening.

Anyone else familiar with Fm6 or Opaltone - What is Opaltone?

FM6 uses FM screening (I think they specify Staccato), cmyk inks and a patented orange and green ink set. The printer pays a "click fee" based on useage. It is used to some extent in the EU. AFAIK it does not reference the pantone library.

Opaltone uses a propietary 7 color cmykrgb inkset, with its own swatchbook of color screen tint builds as well as color libraries of those colors that you load into you authoring application. It does not reference the Pantone library.

Both Equinox and Spotless can basically duplicate the results of those other systems, but at the same time provide much greater flexibility.

Gordo

 

[Steve Donegan]

Can anyone tell me more about options for creating CMYK++ files? What "several vendor offerings" are there exactly besides CoCo & Esko? I've used an Esko photoshop plugin called Ink Tools, but this is limited to 4 channels. I gather the one discussed in this thread is part of Equinox and can handle 7 channels? Does it do a good job of soft-proofing how the 7 channel file will look?

We create our additional channels manually in Photoshop with decent results, but the screen preview (soft-proof) of the 5 or 6 color file never looks remotely like the press test or proof, so there is a lot of trial and error. Just looking for a better way to build these files.

MaxColor is an option.

It is part of the MaxPro suite of Pre Press applications developed for the Packaging industry which was launched at Drupa in 2008.

At this time, we concentrated on developing the MaxPro and MaxStep applications which provide a raster WYSIWYG trapping and step and repeat facility - but colour conversion was on the roadmap for development.

So MaxColor was released at the end of 2010 and won the Flexotech Pre Press Innovation award in 2011 (shortlisted with Esko Studio amongst others) - some info here - FlexoTech November 2011

Agreed, applications such as Photoshop do a poor job of showing ink overlaps once Spot colours have been introduced into an image, but then again Photoshop wasn't developed for the kind of work we are doing/talking about.

One of the strengths of MaxColor is that it has its own monitor calibration facility developed to overcome these issues and provide a faithful on-screen representation of the final print or proof - Works very well with a good quality monitor such as a Eizo Coloredge.

Incidentally, whilst perhaps off-topic but I am sure relevant, a more recent Flexo Screening development (Smart Screen) won the Flexotech 2012 award for the same Pre Press innovation category last October - in a shortlist that included Kodak Spotless. - FlexoTech November 2012

Steve

 

[gordo]

Is there an english language website for MaxColor?

Best girdo

 

[Stephen Marsh]

Is there an english language website for MaxColor?

Best girdo

Gordo, until Steve comes back, this is the only link I have:

MaxPro MaxColor

Steve, do you have deeper info and or demo versions available?


Stephen Marsh

 

[Steve Donegan]

Is there an english language website for MaxColor?

Best girdo

Yes - Graphic Republik - Innovative solutions for Packaging Professionals - you can click through the links for info on the suite of products or download pdf brochures from the homepage.

Steve

 

[Steve Donegan]

Gordo, until Steve comes back, this is the only link I have:

MaxPro MaxColor

Steve, do you have deeper info and or demo versions available?


Stephen Marsh

Stephen,

Yes - fire away with any questions - I'll do my best to answer.

Steve

 

[gordo]

Stephen,

Yes - fire away with any questions - I'll do my best to answer.

Steve

I'd like to see a gradient bitmapped with Smart Screen and a description of its features.

Regarding MaxColor from the info in the brochure it appears to be an application which allows the document to have its rater images rendered using spot colors rather than process - is that correct?
Perhaps you could explain the basic workflow where a printer receives a PDF containing a mix of CMYK images and Spot color text and vector graphics.
Does Maxcolor replace specified spot colors in vector graphics using screen tint builds (as Equinox and Spotless do)? If so, how many colors can it work with?
Does Maxcolor do Hi-Fi (CMYK++) separations? If so how many spot colors can be used?

I'm sure your answers will engender more questions.

thx, gordo

 

[Steve Donegan]

I'd like to see a gradient bitmapped with Smart Screen and a description of its features.

Regarding MaxColor from the info in the brochure it appears to be an application which allows the document to have its rater images rendered using spot colors rather than process - is that correct?
Perhaps you could explain the basic workflow where a printer receives a PDF containing a mix of CMYK images and Spot color text and vector graphics.
Does Maxcolor replace specified spot colors in vector graphics using screen tint builds (as Equinox and Spotless do)? If so, how many colors can it work with?
Does Maxcolor do Hi-Fi (CMYK++) separations? If so how many spot colors can be used?

I'm sure your answers will engender more questions.

thx, gordo

MaxColor is available as a module in MaxPro or as a standalone application.

Standalone, it accepts RGB or CMYK Tiffs and exports a PSD file format - As a module in MaxPro, it accepts the aforementioned plus the MaxPro (.mp) file format.

The.mp file is a raster CT and LW plus if necessary a HCT layer (High Res Contone - dependent on the complexity of the design) held within the single file .mp format.

In it's present guise, MaxColor is developed to utilise Spot Colours which are already present within a job (such as brand colours) and include these in the image or substitute one or more of the existing CMYK channels.

The reason for this is because this is a pretty widespread procedure in Packaging Prepress - its just that there was no serious application available which actually showed on screen what the output would look like or had specific tools to make the procedure less time consuming (hence the development).

Actually I am not sure if substitute is the correct word since it may imply a straight forward channel swap which is not what MaxColor is all about.

So if a printer received say a 6 color job, CMYK + Red + Blue and the job has Blueberries and Strawberries as its main image content, (obvious example) there is a choice to either work on the images separately and export a converted and adjusted PSD file for updating in the original layout or, Raster the complete job (CMYK + Spot text...etc) do the colour conversion, trapping...etc and export a Raster PDF for screening and exposure to plate.

At present the MaxColor engine can create individual colour filters of up to 6 colours of any mixture. (ie CMYK+R+G, CMYK+G+B, CMY+PMS354+PMS032...) which can be applied to individual images.(It is unlikely that any one image will have more than 6 colours)

MaxPro supports up to 64 separations. If you have a CMYK job and you wanted to print HI FI, you can add separations as necessary and using the feature set, generate/convert text, screen tints and images to include the additional separations and adjust as required.

One thing to mention is that your proofing solution needs to be up to the task of showing these CMYK/HI FI/Spot Colour ink overlaps - a lot can't.

 

[Bradleyp]

MaxColor is developed to utilise Spot Colours which are already present within a job (such as brand colours) and include these in the image or substitute one or more of the existing CMYK channels. At present the MaxColor engine can create individual colour filters of up to 6 colours of any mixture. (ie CMYK+R+G, CMYK+G+B, CMY+PMS354+PMS032...) which can be applied to individual images.(It is unlikely that any one image will have more than 6 colours)

Steve, how does MaxColor convert Illustrator (vector) Spot colors to CMYK++? Can you import/edit a recipe library with specific PANTONE > CMK++ %'s similar to Kodak Prinergy?

Brad.

 

[Stephen Marsh]

Stephen,

Yes - fire away with any questions - I'll do my best to answer.

Steve

Steve, your later descriptions remind me of the "good old days" of Scitex systems!

I presume that there is no demo version?


Stephen Marsh

 

[Bradleyp]

FM6 uses FM screening (I think they specify Staccato), cmyk inks and a patented orange and green ink set. The printer pays a "click fee" based on useage. It is used to some extent in the EU. AFAIK it does not reference the pantone library.

According to Fm6, they don't enhance CMYK graphic images either. It doesn't actually mention Pantone. Stochastic screening is a limitation.

Opaltone uses a propietary 7 color cmykrgb inkset, with its own swatchbook of color screen tint builds as well as color libraries of those colors that you load into you authoring application. It does not reference the Pantone library.

According to Opaltone, they have a Photoshop plug-in to enhance CMYK graphic images. Opaltone can separate both vector & raster (no mention of Pantone conversion though)? They also have prepress, print & ink suppliers listed. Anyone out there using Opaltone commercially?

Brad.

 

[gordo]

Thanks Steve D, that clarifies my initial understanding.

What about seeing a gradient bitmapped with Smart Screen and a description of its features.

thx, gordon

 

[gordo]

According to Fm6, they don't enhance CMYK graphic images either. It doesn't actually mention Pantone. Stochastic screening is a limitation.

What I think they do for Pantone is print out a color atlas and then the users chooses a best fit. There are good reasons for using FM. Most of the Spotless printers that I know use FM, not because it's a requirement (it's not) but because it makes lithographic and visual sense to do so.

According to Opaltone, they have a Photoshop plug-in to enhance CMYK graphic images. Opaltone can separate both vector & raster (no mention of Pantone conversion though)? They also have prepress, print & ink suppliers listed. Anyone out there using Opaltone commercially?

As I wrote, Opaltone does not work with the Pantone library instead they have their own library of screen tint builds. If a patch happens to match a color in the Pantone library then you could use that recipe.

gordo

 

[Stephen Marsh]

News: Opaltone opens up spot colour matching system to Pantone - ProPrint

A press release from 15 August 2012 announces:

"In the past, customers had to pay a licence fee and the system would only work with the vendor's proprietary Opaltone Matching System, forcing user to convert colours from the Pantone Matching System (PMS) to OMS. Opaltone modified the licence fee in 2010, and now hopes to make the system more accessible by opening it for use with PMS colours."

What this means in practice is anyone's guess.


Stephen Marsh

 

[Bradleyp]

"In the past, customers had to pay a licence fee and the system would only work with the vendor's proprietary Opaltone Matching System, forcing user to convert colours from the Pantone Matching System (PMS) to OMS. Opaltone modified the licence fee in 2010, and now hopes to make the system more accessible by opening it for use with PMS colours."[/I]What this means in practice is anyone's guess.

I also just found this Opaltone - Wikipedia. In addition to Pantone support, they also claim to have patented a 6-color CMYRGB (no Black?) inkjet system. WTF...?

Brad.

 

[gordo]

As far as I can tell, the ability of Opaltone to simulate te Pantone library only applies to digital imaging, i.e. inkjet proofers, inkjet presses et. al. and not to analog presses. That probably explains the lack of black ink in the process. Pantone charges a fee for the use of their library of spot colors, which is then passed trough to their customer. This library of spot colors includes the L*a*b* values, which are used in conjuction with a profile to simulate the individual spot colors. Opaltone may feel they have a better profile to build the ink combinations to simulate the spot color.

But, like I said, it dosen't appear to apply to anolog systems.

Stephen, time for a tootle up the coast and check it out!

Gordo

 

[Stephen Marsh]

@Steve Donegan

Is MaxColor trying to, as much as possible, reproduce the look of the CMYK gamut of raster images using a mix of spot and or process colours - or is it going to expand the gamut of of CMYK images, or can one do both, within reason of the source image and inks and substrate etc?

Stephen Marsh

 

[Steve Donegan]

@Steve Donegan

Is MaxColor trying to, as much as possible, reproduce the look of the CMYK gamut of raster images using a mix of spot and or process colours - or is it going to expand the gamut of of CMYK images, or can one do both, within reason of the source image and inks and substrate etc?

Stephen Marsh

Two choices - Firstly, reproduce CMYK using Spots where possible (ie, remove one or more of the CMYK channels and replace with Spots, so saving a plate or two) - You would probably choose to do this in a reprint scenario where the original CMYK image needed to be closely matched.

Secondly, instead of matching the CMYK original, use the Spots to enhance the image - less dirty CMYK and cleaner Spot colours. Better for new jobs, new product range...

You are right Stephen - Image inks and substrate would determine how effective the above can be - but MaxColor allows for colour libraries to be built based on the actual LAB values printed as opposed to what in some cases are fantasy Pantone colours (think reverse print on OPP with a non opaque white).

 

[Bradleyp]

MaxColor allows for colour libraries to be built based on the actual LAB values printed as opposed to what in some cases are fantasy Pantone colours (think reverse print on OPP with a non opaque white).

Steve, this was my question from last week:

Can MaxColor convert Illustrator (vector) Spot colors to CMYK++? Can you import/edit a recipe library with specific PANTONE > CMYK++ tint percentages (i.e. not Lab values) similar to Kodak Prinergy?

Brad.

 

[Steve Donegan]

Steve, this was my question from last week:

Can MaxColor convert Illustrator (vector) Spot colors to CMYK++? Can you import/edit a recipe library with specific PANTONE > CMYK++ tint percentages (i.e. not Lab values) similar to Kodak Prinergy?

Brad.

MaxColor as a standalone application accepts RGB or CMYK Tiff files and exports PSD for placement after conversion and adjusting/retouching.

If you wanted to work on text and tint (vector) then you would use MaxColor within MaxPro. That way you could work on all elements in one file. So we would RIP the Illustrator file into LW and CT at say 2400 Res for LW and 300 for CT. You can actually Raster LW up to 5800 Res.

The Colour Library allows for up to 64,000 colour palettes with each individual palette having a mix of up to 64 separations (OK, extreme and you would never use that many seps or palettes but there's the spec).