looking for a new machine

[bigben]

Hi! My name is Ben. I'm new on this forum and in the digital printing business. I'm running a sign company (wide format printing) for about five year now. I'm looking for a printer to to specific job. 90% of the print will be use to make booklet using 8,5X11 paper and 11X17 paper. My average workflow will be around 50000 and 65000 click per month 70% color. I know I will need the finisher option and a extra cabinet for paper.

Due to my area, I need to choose between konica and xerox to have a near tech service.

I was thinking about the Konica C552 + finisher + extra cabinet.

What do your think and/or what do you suggest? Give me all the details you can...

Thank you!

Ben.

 

[Craig]

Start with the KM6501, I don't think with the 552 you have any room for growth. The brochure and sales monkey may say it will but I firmly believe you need at least 50% more capacity than you think you need.

 

[bigben]

Start with the KM6501, I don't think with the 552 you have any room for growth. The brochure and sales monkey may say it will but I firmly believe you need at least 50% more capacity than you think you need.

Can you elaborate, because I'm not sure to understand what you mean by this? The rep told me I can go up to 70000 clic per month with a C552 (not every month).

If I make some calculation of my main customer:

booklet of 13 pages (26 clic) X 2500= 65000 clic at an average of 22.5ppm due to dual print will take around 50 hours to print. So my total orders of my main custumer can be made in 5 or 6 business days. I have 3 more weeks to do the others job... Digital printing will never be my main business and it will probably be use for this customer only. Sure I will do other jobs, but it's not my main business.

Thanks again for your help.

Ben

 

[tppsg]

Ben, the duty cycle of the machine can be misleading. Even a $500 desktop laser printer has a duty cycle of 100k prints a month. You should ask your sales rep what is the average number of colour prints made by the copier in the field. And if you are planning to print on other substrates other than just woodfree paper, give the duty cycle another heavy discount.

 

[andreisarbu]

new machine

new machine

In most cases, average monthly print volume is 30% duty cycle. So, if that machine has 70000 click duty cycle, you should look at that machine if you plane to print no more than 25000 on monthly basis. That's my personal opinion.

 

[UberTech]

If you want to shoe box yourself into one specific job that just does booklets on 80gsm paper you may get away with that machine. If you want to expand and have a reliable machine that will do everything then you will have to get a pro machine. Did you know the max paper size for that machine is 311mm?

 

[bigben]

If you want to shoe box yourself into one specific job that just does booklets on 80gsm paper you may get away with that machine. If you want to expand and have a reliable machine that will do everything then you will have to get a pro machine. Did you know the max paper size for that machine is 311mm?

Ok, then could you tell me what machine I sould choose? The KM C5501? Or I absoulutly need to go with the KM C6501 or Xerox X700?

The KM C552 is aroud 25k with the options and the X700 is around 65k with the options. That's more than the double.

And again, with my calculation, the C552 will only run one week per month. I still have 3 weeks to do the other stuff.

About the 311mm thing, 12X18 seems to be big enough... In what kind of product I will need 13X19?

I'm sorry for all my questions, but I want to know the more details as possible to make the good choice.

Thanks again.

Ben

 

[UberTech]

SRA3 is the standard size where I am which is 320x450 maybe in quebec 12x18 is the norm. Like I say if you don't expect to do much else then you could get away with this machine. If you intend on doing business cards or anything that has constant high coverage that machine may stuggle.

The 5501 differs only in speed to the C6501 and finishing options, ie no 200 page saddle stich option. You can only have a FS-607 or a catch tray.

 

[bigben]

ok, if i check the difference between the KM c552 and the KM c5501... There's piratically nothing... Does the only thing with the c5501 is that machine is someking of ''heavy duty'' fabrication?

What do you have to say about the Xerox 700 compared to the konica brand?

 

[UberTech]

The only simularity would be the speed. The 5501 is a more industrial unit compared to the office type 552. If you go and see the machines this will become clear quite quickly.

How would I compare the 700 to a 5501? Not a can of worms I would like to open. Once again go and look at a X700 and compare. Don't be sucked in by the propaganda, make sure who ever you go with has good service. Konica's aren't any more unreliable than others, but a machine is only as good as it's service.

 

[Craig]

I think you are looking at this wrong when you say you can do the required work in 1 or 2 weeks and it will sit idle the rest. As Uber said don't make the mistake to buy a machine for only 1 job. More than likely you will find that other items will present themselves, like greeting cards for instance. You surely don't want to turn that work away. Buy for the future, not the present day.

 

[bigben]

I think you are looking at this wrong when you say you can do the required work in 1 or 2 weeks and it will sit idle the rest. As Uber said don't make the mistake to buy a machine for only 1 job. More than likely you will find that other items will present themselves, like greeting cards for instance. You surely don't want to turn that work away. Buy for the future, not the present day.

So with that in mind, does the KM C5501 is enough or you would recommend the KM C6501 or Xerox X700?

What would be the competitor of the KM C5501 in Xerox brand?

 

[UberTech]

The compeditor to a 5501 would (I assume) be a DC250 you would have to check with xerox. Once again the difference between the 5501 and 6501 is speed only, and usually click cost. You finishing options on the 5501 are limited to a basic saddle stich finisher.

 

[bigben]

The compeditor to a 5501 would (I assume) be a DC250 you would have to check with xerox. Once again the difference between the 5501 and 6501 is speed only, and usually click cost. You finishing options on the 5501 are limited to a basic saddle stich finisher.

Ok, I'll check this. Thanks for all the infos.

Could you tell me what would be the average price per clic on the KM 5501, KM 6501 and Xerox X700? Assuming I have an average of 65000 clic per month at 90% colour?

Thanks again.

Ben

 

[UberTech]

Click charges vary alot and generally aren't volume/coverage dependant. A wild etimate would be around 0.09 to give you a ball park. Just remeber, getting a Xerox is a bit like getting herpes, if you want them or not they are with you the rest of your life.

 

[bigben]

Click charges vary alot and generally aren't volume/coverage dependant. A wild etimate would be around 0.09 to give you a ball park. Just remeber, getting a Xerox is a bit like getting herpes, if you want them or not they are with you the rest of your life.

great! thanks! But what do you mean by ''Just remeber, getting a Xerox is a bit like getting herpes, if you want them or not they are with you the rest of your life.''

 

[UberTech]

Caveat emptor

 

[geoman]

BigBen,

I think the "herpes" reference by UberTech is some kind of slight on Xerox.

 

[bigben]

BigBen,

I think the "herpes" reference by UberTech is some kind of slight on Xerox.

ok, I understand now. Anyway, for the price, I think KM would be a better choice for me. But If it wasn't about the price, I would take the xerox. I can't tell you why... reputation maybe...

 

[Craig]

Don't just shop by price, look REAL hard at service as well, after all it will be your life line.