Xerox 700

[jetblackmgx]

Do you think it is reasonable to use a xerox 700 as your general workhorse machine to compete in the online printing marketplace? It just seems that the online print marketplace is so competitive, and the profit margins are razor thin.

We need a machine that has a tight registration, and the sales rep said a xerox 700 would be great for color copies, brochures, postcards, business cards, etc. Do you think it's realistic to run this machine to support a online print shop?


Sorry, I'm new to the print industry! Any help would be appreciated.

 

[Craig]

Re: Xerox 700

When you say workhorse, how much volume do you anticipate each month? Do you currently offer digital printing? Did your sale rep point out that the AMPV is only 20,000 to 75,000 impressions? Don't put too much credence in what any sales rep is saying, their job is to sell you something period. They will tell you what you want to hear, you need to read between the lines. I'm not saying they are misleading you, but some times they tend to gloss over certain things. Do a lot of research, talk to as many companies as you can and find out why their machines are the best. Go to Graph Expo if you can and see some of the stuff on the floor, kick the tires, take a USB drive with some PDF files on the and ask for prints so you can compare apples to apples from each machine.
These are not small investments by any means, take your time and be informed, go online and read as much as you can on a machine before you talk to the sales rep.

Good Luck

 

[X33]

any Xerox machine can support a printing business, from the DocuColor 240, passing by the Xerox 700 up to the iGen4.

it's going to depend on 2 things (among many others) :

1. Print volume
2. How profitable your applications are

for instance, if you only plan to print only business cards, we know that profits are very low in that application, competition is fierce, so you need a lot of volume.

but if you plan to print Customized Variable Data Marketing Campagins, profits are a lot higher and you may need much less volume to justify the equipment.

you'll need to find the break point depending on what you plan to do. Your Xerox Rep should be able to help you with that.

 

[duceyco]

We have been running our 700 with great anticipation that this will be a very good seller with very good results.

With a +/- 1mm registration, this is the tightest registration I have seen on a machine of this price point. I love using our DC260 (both Bustled and EX260) and printed a picture of my little girl. Compared it to the 700 and while both did a very well, the difference that the 700 provides is visible even at a glance.

This machine is classified as production so printshops got a machine that can handle the work.

Where it is just launched, I don't have enough to go on really, but from what I and the other members of my team have tested so far, I got a good feeling on the 700.

 

[digitalpress sales demon]

Take a good look at the market place and speak to a number of vendors, try to speak to two vendors for each manufacturer to drive down cost and maximise the value in your new aquisition. Ensure that you choose a machine that is suitable for your volume and remember the golden rule.

The Konica Minolta 6500 (IKON CPP650) and Canon C6000V have engines that are comparable and some would argue to be better value than the Xerox 700 (which is still a Xerox 260 unit to all intents and purposes).

Depending upon your printing applications, media weights/ media types (silk, gloss,off set stocks), registration and the degree of variable content being printed there will be an abundance of solutions for you to entertain.

The front end server infrastruture, be it a Creo, Fiery or a manufacturer own is just as important as the print engine. No quality here and you will have no quality with your output which will drive down your selling out price for your hard work and endeavour. Personally, I feel there is more value in Fiery products and most vendors will agree with this when push comes to shove.

Beware sales people who upsell too much and are too forward thinking and too optimistic for your online business model ... and check that the stocks that you want to sell out register through the devices accurately ...

Choose wisely ...

 

[X33]

I just want to clarify, the new Xerox 700 is not a "bigger" Xerox DC260. They might look similar in the outside, but they are many differences inside; they don't even share the same frame. The Xerox 700 has a different print engine, paper path and rollers, fuser module, it uses different toner, it has decurling, alignment and paper profilers (things that the DC260 does not have), among other things, and it has also more flexible options such a dual oversized high capacity feeder, a high capacity stacker with a dolly and a new booklet maker.

like the previous user said, do your research, just don't forget to look at the Xerox portfolio, especially the new Xerox 700

 

[random]

'paper profilers' that sounds exciting. What do they do?

 

[Craig]

Random, I'm already feeling the negative vibes

Looks like xerox had to introduce a "lower class" production model to compete head to head with that 6500 of yours.

Paper profiling does sound rather interesting though..... NOT! It's frigging paper for the love of Pete, how many "profiles" do we need to have already.

 

[X33]

when you create a new Paper Profile, it will have these settings : Paper Size, Paper Type and Weight, Paper Color, and most importantly : Paper Curl, and Alignment Adjustment settings unique for this Paper Profile.

we know that all 100lb cover stock doesn't perform the same. so you might have that stock from vendor A with different Curl and Alignment settings in Paper Profile A, than the same media from vendor B on Paper Profile B.

 

[random]

Please tell me your 8000 does that Craig.

 

[Craig]

I can profile 10 (whoopdy doo) I have used 1 only for 2nd BTB settings for a fiber stock we print for a customer.

 

[Thomson Litho]

i take rflores is a xerox employee or something?? sorry if i have that wrong or are you just a stauge supporter of the xerox machines?? I am wondering if there are many others who have invested in the 700 as of yet and what spec you went for??
Now what do you guys think or heard of the Rioch pro c900, looks a bit of a beast, any idea of price though?

 

[smatros]

currently the 700 has plenty of problems and is unreliable. in 1 year i believe it will be highly competitive unit.

 

[ian]

700 - registration issues

700 - registration issues

Hi jetblackmgx, I would not recommend a 700 if you need tight register. We just bought one and the registration is out a lot. If you need registration then you have to stick to the production models like 5000, 7000 or 8000. Our 6060 which is an older machine registers 100% better than the 700

Ian

 

[duceyco]

Registration for the 700

Registration for the 700

If your registration is off then there is a problem with your machine, not the model itself. We have one and the registration is bang on (+/- 1mm). Even when duplexing 80lb gloss.

If you are hearing this from other people, then I would say your claim is valid. I support the model and I have yet to come across a registration problem with a customer.

And the DC260 is similar only in the direction of the paper path, the control panel and the finishers LOOK similar. The 700's print engine is larger and far more beefy compared to the DC260 series. The Pro finisher and the Light Production Finisher can fold 25 sheets as opposed to the 15 sheets on the DC260 series. I have printed photos on this model and it is the closest to skin tones than any of our previous models. Even that of the DC12's. It still doesn't carry the shine of the DC12 (due to the Fuser oil in the DC12 as opposed to the dry fuser in the 700), but with the newer EA toner, the pattern is very uniform and tight (under a loop you can clearly see this) and it still provides a decent shine.

Just to add to that, I do not blindly protect and defend Xerox and it's products. If I feel a member on this forum is correct, I do not have a problem agreeing any more than disputing their statements.

 

[ian]

Xerox700 Problems

Xerox700 Problems

If you calculate +/- 1mm per side then the image can be off as much as 4mm on a two sided job... this is not the 80's when a customer would accept that much tolerance, the 5000 on a double sided sheet is off a total of only 0.5mill. When running brochures, booklets or business cards we only run 1/6" bleed if the drift is 1/8" how do we sell the job?? You need to come into the real world requirements of clients then you might understand.
The only jobs we have been able to run so far are single sided jobs, b/w photocopy jobs and simple colour photocopy jobs where register is not an issue. Its an expensive peice of equipment to have on the floor to run on offset stocks caus the 5000 does a bad job on those stocks.

As for the Print quality, there is an issue when running heavy coverage, there is gloss differential, also the solid colours dont lay down properly on any gloss cover stock. Try running black on 12pt Gloss and you will get Gray.

Ian

If your registration is off then there is a problem with your machine, not the model itself. We have one and the registration is bang on (+/- 1mm). Even when duplexing 80lb gloss.

If you are hearing this from other people, then I would say your claim is valid. I support the model and I have yet to come across a registration problem with a customer.

And the DC260 is similar only in the direction of the paper path, the control panel and the finishers LOOK similar. The 700's print engine is larger and far more beefy compared to the DC260 series. The Pro finisher and the Light Production Finisher can fold 25 sheets as opposed to the 15 sheets on the DC260 series. I have printed photos on this model and it is the closest to skin tones than any of our previous models. Even that of the DC12's. It still doesn't carry the shine of the DC12 (due to the Fuser oil in the DC12 as opposed to the dry fuser in the 700), but with the newer EA toner, the pattern is very uniform and tight (under a loop you can clearly see this) and it still provides a decent shine.

Just to add to that, I do not blindly protect and defend Xerox and it's products. If I feel a member on this forum is correct, I do not have a problem agreeing any more than disputing their statements.

 

[X33]

If you calculate +/- 1mm per side then the image can be off as much as 4mm on a two sided job

the Xerox Customer Expectation Document says that registration is +/-1mm Front to Back (duplex); that is 0.5mm per side.

 

[GregNac19]

Guys, I just went to see this model first hand. Registration was dead on. You can even adjust the registration in "profile" for any particular paper and save the settings plus recall them when you need them again.
I do sell for Xerox and I took samples to 2 of my print shops today. Everything was measured from side to side and front to back. You will have no problem running 110Lb Cover Gloss through the machine running 12X18 to make 30 business cards. The cutter will be ready!

 

[ian]

Registration issues

Registration issues

Maybe you can give me a contact I can call regarding this problem, the analyst gave up and told me there is nothing they can do about it. I guess my next question would be did we get a lemon??

Ian

Guys, I just went to see this model first hand. Registration was dead on. You can even adjust the registration in "profile" for any particular paper and save the settings plus recall them when you need them again.
I do sell for Xerox and I took samples to 2 of my print shops today. Everything was measured from side to side and front to back. You will have no problem running 110Lb Cover Gloss through the machine running 12X18 to make 30 business cards. The cutter will be ready!

 

[UberTech]

Maybe you can give me a contact I can call regarding this problem, the analyst gave up and told me there is nothing they can do about it. I guess my next question would be did we get a lemon??

Ian

No, probably not. Your findings are consistent with deals we have won from Xerox. There probably is a perfectly running 700 in a showroom somewhere and eventually how this was acheived will trickle down to the field.

DuceyCo - You should get the machine in your Xerox showroom installed at Ians place just to prove your point.